Date: Fri, 15 Apr 1994 20:07:41 -0500
From: Derek C Catt <r10dcc1@corn.cso.niu.edu>
Subject: STuff #4 -- Taxes and the ST

<><><><><><><>< STuff #4 April 15, 1994 ><><><><><><><><>

The 'lectronic ST Newsletter!!
(Endorsed by the STOC)

For those of you who are Stateside, I hope you've taken care of your
taxes, otherwise, you just ran out of time. In this issue of
STuff you will find a table of contents! A first! (People all
over the 'Net are agasp in surprise!) - Enjoy!

Derek, STuff Grammarian
"Second Generation 'Cyclists -- we're born to ride!" (tm)

Cheesey Table of Contents:

Rear-end woes
Handlebar replacement
Rear-end non-woes
ST Fiction
ST Handeling Comments
More Rear-end comments

<><><><><><><><><><><><Rear-end woes><><><><><>><><><><><><><>

From: Jim Alexander <jalexand@netcom.com>

As many ST owners may know, there have been some reports of rear end
problems. I have the pleasure of personally confirming the problem.
Last summer during a trip in Georgia, I noticed a significant amount of
looseness in the rear end while mounting a new set of Avon ST radials.
I also noticed how dry the splines and other parts of the rear end were.
Since I normally have someone else do the tire work, I didn't know if this
was normal, but re-greased everything as required. At this point I had
49,000 miles on the bike. I had no problems with the rear end the entire
remainder of the 7,500 mile trip. In September with 59,000 miles,
I needed a rear tire so I arranged for another Avon ST, because I have a
usual dealer I checked an found that they didn't have an Avon in stock,
so I called around and found a Honda dealer who did. During the tire
replacement, I was informed that the rear end was dry and was about 40%
gone so I should keep and eye on it. During the month of December, it
was time for a major service (64,000 miles), so I dropped it off at my
usual dealer and mentioned I was concerned about the rear end and wanted
it checked. Later that day, I got a phone call confirming my worst
fears ... the rear end was shot or very close to it. The service manager
had already contacted Honda and had a preliminary OK to do a warranty
repair, but it was going to need confirmation.

Parts were ordered and the OK came after an inspection of the old unit.
After removal of the final gear assembly from the drive shaft, it was
noticed that even the drive shaft joint (a splined joint between the
final gear assembly and the drive shaft) was shot. I had the opportunity
to see the parts and it wasn't pretty. You could actually see the affect
of twist forces on the splines. In addition, the final drive flange and
the rear wheel rubber dampers were replaced. The final drive flange is
the round flange assembly with a splined end that fits into the final
gear assembly and on the other side the five fingers that fit into the
actual wheel. The Honda specified gear lube was definitely used during
the re-assembly (NLGI No 2 - Molybdenum disulfide additive). While it was
a warranty replacement, I did see the bill going to Honda and it was over
$1,200 for the entire job!

After the work was done, I checked both the owner's manual and the shop
service manual for maintenance schedules covering the rear end. No where
are these items specified as needing specific attention!

After another 4,000 miles, I decided to have both tires replaced and took
it back to the same dealer who did the rear end work. During the rear tire
change, we noticed that already some of the gear lube had flown off the
drive flange fingers and splines. Also, we had noticed that a noticeable
amount of dust had started to collect in the area. The mechanic took
special precaution to make sure all part were greased properly when the
rear wheel was replaced.

I guess the only comment would be to periodically spend time taking your
rear wheel off, inspecting the condition, and re-greasing the whole thing.
I wonder how many people will not put as many miles on their ST as I have
in 2.5 years and will not experience the pleasure of rear end replacement
during the warranty period but outside of it?

<><><><><><><><><><><><><Handle bar replacement><><><><><><><<>><>

The following was sent to the ST1100 Newsletter:
From: gac@intgp1.att.com (George A Catt +1 708 979 9424)
Subject: STuff

Grant,

You asked for info on how Derek converted his ST to different
bars. Well here's the simple version. First of all, the work
was done by the original owner. Derek is third. But, as you
can see from the pictures, it's really an easy job IF you don't
fuss with the vanity cover.
{pictures not included in STuff -- sorry guys}

Use any standard, non-drilled 7/8" bars. Unclamp the stock bars.
Remove all the associated hardware and let it dangle. No need
to disconnect anything unless you have to re-route cables and
wires to get some additional length. There's enough slack,
though, for both taller and more pulled back bars. With some
judicious rerouting, you can gain more than 2 inches.

Install the new bars of your choice {aftermarket Kawasaki LTD
bars on mine -- Derek}, add the switches, etc., and try it out.
If you're REAL ambitious, polish the aluminum top plate to a
high gloss. The only thing that looks out of place is the too
tall ignition switch. Derek says he can live with this.
Besides, the key fob and other keys dangle instead of scratching
up the aluminum {or beauty cover}. If someone wants to run a
cross reference, there's probably another Honda ignition with a
shorter top that would bolt right in.

The second picture shows a fiberglass cover for the top plate
that goes under rather than over the bars. It was a prototype
made by a friend of Derek's. He {the friend} ended up with a
much fancier version, and added Honda Shadow risers and pull
back bars to fit his 5' 7" stature. Also color matched it to
his red ST. Most important is the addition of a Pacific Coast
clutch hose to gain 8 inches, an expensive but functional
solution. Less expensive alternatives for longer hoses are
available from Dennis Kirk.

We've also seen the Sabre bars on an ST. This installation
involved trimming the stock vanity cover to clear the additional
height of the bars (the top of the cover is trimmed to allow the
more vertical part of the bar escape). Simple enough. But the
stock bars also have an additional welded-on brace for the
vanity cover. I don't know how Frank addressed this. Derek
says that at least one owner had the brace welded to the new
bars.

The third picture shows this brace on Derek's stock bars, which
now reside in my attic along with his vanity cover. You'll
notice the stock grips are still in place. He is now running
BMW K-Bike grips, which he says are more comfortable. $15 at
your local BMW dealer. (What I notice is that he rides much
more upright than I do.)

I'm not going to do anything to my bars until Heli-Modified
comes out with their new product. Actually, with the taller
Rifle shield, and Corbin Dual Canyon seat, I'm pretty happy.
But I've also got a 35" sleeve. (Derek's is 37". He probably
wouldn't have done the modification if his bike had been stock
when he bought it.)

<><><><Rear-end non-woes><><><>
Other STuff: Derek and I both greased our rear ends {THE ST's
REAR END!} last week. The pictures show Derek in mid-process.
We didn't pull the swing arm, as this requires a special tool.
Derek's splines, with 47K miles, looked fine: no twists, no
powder.

We used Extreme High Pressure Moly Grease available from your
favorite auto parts store for $2/4 oz. My splines had never
been touched (currently 24K miles) and needed the grease, but no
obvious wear. Derek's had obviously been done before. We don't
ride as hard as Rocky Rhodes, but we don't let any grass grow,
either. Maybe a smooth throttle hand has something to do with
it. The parts look identical to the GL1500, and I've not heard
of any of those bikes having problems. I put 74K on mine and
that part, at least, never missed a lick.

When re-assembling, be sure to grease the studs on the rear
pumpkin, as well as the axle, shock bolt, rear brake bolt, and
left swing arm pinch bolt. Corrosion on any of these will just
make the next time harder.

And, there will be a next time. We currently have ordered the
swing arm lock nut wrench and the head set lock nut socket.
These two tools alone will run over $70. Sitting on the shelf
at home are two sets of Hap-Jones tapered roller bearings for
the head set. I hope to send in an article about their
installation for the summer issue.

George Catt
P.S I got an answer from Honda concerning my Feb. letter:
"Thank you for your interesting comments. We are always glad to
hear from satisfied owners. Blah, blah blah, blah blah." No
answers or sugstantive comments.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><>ST Fiction<><><><><><><><><>

{The following was captured from rec.motorcycles, USENET}
From: daved@world.std.com (Dave T Dorfman)

Tom McMath <mcmath@delphi.com> writes:
>I am thinking about buying a ST1100 and would like to here
>some comments from anyone who owns one. Does anyone out
>there own one that will give me a little revue
>on the bike . It would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Yes, the honda ST1100 is the greatest motorcycle ever built, it
was designed by the smartest guys at Los Alamos, livermore and
Caltech while on a super secret convention near Deal's Gap.
{For those who are not familiar, Deal's Gap is a 'town' in N. Carolina at
one end of a great motorcycle road -- US 129 -- 318 mountain curves
in eleven miles of the Smokie Mountains. --Derek}
Regardless of the apparent engine ( it looks like a V4 liquid
cooled, shaft drive torque monster) it is actually powered by an
anti gravity postular accelerator, primary power isprovided by a
small fast breeder reactor fuel cell contained in the right
handlebar weight. The ST is also equipped with a large X-Ray
laser designed to vaporize Deer at 200 yards ( 400 yards on full
moon lit evenings ). Equipped with the proper K+N air filter it
is capable of self propelled flights, and is theoretically
capable of space travel under the proper conditions.

Buy one, it might not live up to the above expectations but it
is at least as good if not better then any of the Beemers at a
much lower price. I have had one for two years, it is fun to
ride, fast , handles well for a 680 pound touring bike and has
been very reliable. The integrated luggage works well and
handles up to four small bags of groceries.

There are a few nice after market accesories available for it
such as Corbin Seats, extra high windshields, and custom tank
bags, but the bike is great just as delivered from Honda.

If you are considering ABS/TCS check the back issues of
motorcyclist over the last 24 months for a full comparison and
evaluation of the ABS/TCS system.

They have held their value pretty well, the last used sale I
heard of was for a 91 with 3000 miles for 6900 ( probably 500
less then the new price in 91). A 91 left over should cost
around 73-7500. Maybe less.
94 with ABS/TCS should go for around 10K$ , about 3500 cheaper
then the comparable Beemer or Yamaha.

Be second to none , buy the ST.

Dave "completely unbiased ST owner" dorfman

{I guess Tom liked Dave's story -- Tom recently posted a message
saying he had bought a '93 ST.}

><><><><><><><><><><><><><ST Handeling comments><><><><><><>

From: dmk@garden.WPI.EDU (David M Kingsland)
Newsgroups: rec.motorcycles
Subject: Re: Concours vs. Pacific Coast

[previous drivel deleted]

No way, not even close in handling. The K75S model would probably
challenge the ST for handling capability, but not the RT. Simply
too slow/soft/flexy. Ride an ST if you get the chance. I personally
guarantee that you will be amazed about how good Honda got a 688
pound bike to handle. Handles better than my FJ1200. Both on the
street and on the track (rode them back to back at CLASS). My one
ride on a Concours left me unimpressed with handling. Compared to
the ST, the Concours is tall and top heavy, has heavier steering,
poorer wheel control, and gives less feedback from the tire - but
it is good in sweepers. I can't say anything about the PC800,
since I haven't ridden one. But if you want an inexpensive new
bike for primarily touring and commuting, it is probably a great
choice. My .02

Dave kingsland

{Not too often you see an FJ owner ADMITTING the ST handles better!}

<><><><><><><><><><><><><More rear-end comments><><><><><><><><>

Jim is correct above. The service manual doens't 'call' for any
maintenance to the shaft drive system on the ST. I talked to my
Honda mechanic and he says his shop greases the final ring gear at
the wheel anytime they take the wheel off. It looked like they did.
And yours should be done anytime the wheel comes off too.
However, there are splines that need greasing where the shaft system
meets the "pumpkin" housing, this requires removal of the pumpkin.
I doubt this NEEDS greased at EVERY tire change -- its probably a good
idea to make sure its done every other tire change. My father's
was DRY, and mine NEEDED grease (it looked like it had been done before).
We haven't removed the swing arm to check the front of the drive shaft
(and the swing arm bearings) yet. We'll be sure to let you know what
we find. The service manual doesn't provide a recommendation
for checking/greasing this either. I don't think it needs to be
checked every tire change. You will find out what mine looks
like at 47k miles as soon as we open it up.

--Derek

<><><><><><><><><><><><><Coming soon. .. . ..><><><><><><><><><>

In the next issue of STuff:

Do George and Derek get their STs back together??
The Steering Head Bearing Switch-A-Roo!!!
(with comments about a local Honda shop)

Plus anything else I find, or you'all send me.